User talk:D. Matt Innis/Archive 1

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Nov 2006 - Mar 2007

The many forms that life takes on Earth

I like it, but there's something wrong. What is it? --D. Matt Innis 16:18, 1 December 2006 (CST)

Excuse me for butting in, but don't we want some more along the lines of this? The advantage I see here is that which ever pictures are chosen the originals can be easily found. In the future it might allow for interactive features, such as sound, since each picture cell is independent. Chris Day (Talk) 17:34, 1 December 2006 (CST)
No need for apologies Chris, I really appreciate your input. I think the one I made was definitely too "tight" (for lack of a better word). But I'm thinking the other is too "loose". There must be a just right. I'm not sure I'm following the "ease of finding pictures", though, could you explain. I'm sure this is not the last time I'll be faced with this and need to have a good grasp on the "rules". I would assume CZ is going to set up a Citizendium Commons where we can save this and add whatever we want (music, etc.) as well. Am I missing something? --D. Matt Innis 17:48, 1 December 2006 (CST)
If you click on the each photo it takes you too the original. I agree it is probably too loose but I think overlaps are impossible when transcluding the originals? Chris Day (Talk) 20:53, 1 December 2006 (CST)
I see what you mean, that could be a real advantage to click on each and have it play a sound, etc. I like it! Do you know how to do that? --D. Matt Innis 21:23, 1 December 2006 (CST)

Number two

As08-16-2593.jpg File:KildLaughing.jpg
Mariposa Grove Squoias.JPG
Serengeti Lion Running1.jpg
LightRefractsOf comb-rows of ctenophore Mertensia ovum.jpg
Biology studies the variety of life

Hey Chris, I just noticed this was yours! I didn't realize you were already working on this. It looks like you have this one under control really well, so I'll move on to other stuff. I hope you don't mind if I keep an eye on how you do it, I need to learn as much as I can before things get wild. --D. Matt Innis 19:49, 3 December 2006 (CST)

I just added two more photo's. We are lacking a picture of bacteria. i am thinking a hot spring might be a good one for that. I'll probably be messing around a bit more. Any other must have pictures you have seen? Chris Day (Talk) 23:42, 3 December 2006 (CST)
I like it!! It seems like I saw a bacteria somewhere, don't know about the hot spring, but I'll go back through and see where it was then you can decide if it's what you're looking for. I think you've got everything else covered, I would love to seeif you can add some other media to it like you were saying. I haven't seen anything like that, have you? --D. Matt Innis 07:33, 4 December 2006 (CST)
Did you know this is what e.coli looked like? It is neat, too bad its not in color or it would really be good. I think we can use anything we find at the CDC, as its government isn't it? --D. Matt Innis 08:03, 4 December 2006 (CST)
Just updated further. I think there are probably too many pictures now. I have hotsprings for bacteria right now, since that has some info on the environment too. The root of the tree of life is currently populated by thermophillic bacteria, so a hot spring is probably quite appropriate. Chris Day (Talk) 01:43, 5 December 2006 (CST)

Hope you're cooking up some new images for chiropractic, it would be nice to get that approved early tooGareth Leng 17:18, 4 December 2006 (CST)

Matt, there are several very recent (2006) big randomized clinical studies on chiropractic that I'd like to e-mail you. We should have a little journal club between us, I think - because at least a couple of these need to be mentioned in the article. I can't post them here without copyright infringement. My e-mail is If you e-mail me your e-mail, I'll send you these, one by one. Nancy Sculerati MD 21:36, 9 December 2006 (CST)

Sounds good! I'll shoot you a message right over. --D. Matt Innis 22:27, 9 December 2006 (CST)

Thanks so much for the user page picture Matt, and your kind comment! Nancy Sculerati MD 19:32, 11 December 2006 (CST)

DC article

Matt, please look at the talk page. I just don't know what to do about the length except to break it up into 2 articles. Nancy Sculerati MD

Please look again at DC talk page Matt, we have a problem. I'd like to work it out. Nancy Sculerati MD

Matt, I am going through the article now, As I think we have come to the finish line, I'd like to ask a favor. Please read it carefully and make a note of anything that strikes you as wrong or "funny" ON THE TALK PAGE of the article. Just copy and paste from the atricle and move it over, and we can discuss it and hammer out resolutions. Nancy Sculerati MD

I think I'm done. Nancy Sculerati MD


I have to take a break for real life commitments. Chris Day (Talk) 14:06, 20 December 2006 (CST)

Matt, I have to bow out for a while. I'll look in a few days. We had a good article that just needed copyediting. This is too frustrating for me at the moment. I'm feeling that I need a break until there is a clear approval process, otherwise we are just spinning our wheels. Nancy Sculerati MD

Some general comments
I wouldn't say we are spinning wheels. The references really were all over the place, too much so for an approved article. It will not take long to sort out such problems. I think we do need to consider quality issues as well content issues. If it gets approved in a state of lower quality then there is a good chance we all move on to other articles and when CZ goes public those aprroved articles will be the first that critics look at. It needs to be publication quality and that means references pictures need to be in order too. I think Larry's comments were very important too, not defining terms up front is a problem.
May be i have a different idea to what an approved article should look like? Is there any thread on the forums to that has discussed this issue? Chris Day (Talk) 16:23, 20 December 2006 (CST)
I think it is all important. I am sure that Nancy is concerned about the words, nothing that you have changed. You are absolutely right about getting it to look right.. Nancy puts her heart into the words. It's hard to watch your well thought out sentences/paragraphs get wiped out. Sometimes it is downright painful. --Matt Innis (Talk) 16:36, 20 December 2006 (CST)


Did you get permission from Daniel D. Baleckaitis to use this photo? -- Melanie St Clair 10:55, 22 December 2006 (CST)

Approval Process

The approval process has to be done by a constable. Talk to Ruth Ifcher or User:Sarah Tuttle. They seem relatively active (or at least look at the wiki rather often. Bernard Haisch and Fred Salsbury are personnel administrators, so they have the technical ability to complete the approval process if you can't get a hold of any constables. The remaining process is straightforward, but several parts of it need a "sysop" (what WP calls Administrators) to do, so you need to lasso one of them. Let me know how it goes.--ZachPruckowski 11:05, 28 December 2006 (CST)

Happy to help in any way that I can. That's what I'm here for. --ZachPruckowski 23:55, 29 December 2006 (CST)


Matt, could you help us out on metabolism? Remember that great weight lifter picture you had for chiropractic? We could use it in that article for anabolism. If you'd be so kind as to upload it to the article, I 'll play with the caption. thanks, Nancy Sculerati MD 08:07, 30 December 2006 (CST)

Vertebral subluxation

Made changes in article and talk page, please go over and coment. Thanks, Nancy Sculerati MD 11:59, 17 January 2007 (CST)

Matt, I'm not able to really give this my attention now, sorry. Worse than that- I'm going to ask you a favor instead of complying. I was hoping you would download a short video on the web so that I can put it in Mixed-breed dog, or Dog. I'm not sure. I'll e-mail you. Regards, nancy Nancy Sculerati MD 10:25, 30 January 2007 (CST)

Yes, Matt- would you kindly put it in dog, freeze it with the option of animaltion- and make it smaller so that the resolution is better? Thank you- many times over. Nancy Sculerati MD 09:35, 31 January 2007 (CST) I think the smaller is better- but (sorry...) I found the original file. I'm going to e-mail it to you- meanwhile-look at Vertebral Subluxation Nancy Sculerati MD 14:23, 31 January 2007 (CST)

Matt, I tried a format change in Vertebral subluxation. Could you look at the first couple of lines now, and then go back to the last Gareth Leng revision and see which you like best? I made two changes, that's why you should go back to before you see I made any recent ones before you check. Thanks, NancyNancy Sculerati MD 12:37, 9 February 2007 (CST)

Thanks for alerting me about my page, it had been protected and I didn't know, so with your 'heads up' I got it fixed. Nancy Sculerati MD 16:52, 9 February 2007 (CST) keep enjoying yourself, welcoming :) Robert Tito | Talk 13:51, 14 February 2007 (CST) The fun is ofcourse the vandals, but I come and go as well, working on a presentation as it is - hence I need to get my thoughts clear to be able to formulate more compact and to the point :) (not forgetting the science at the same time - and keeping it as simple as possibly can. Robert Tito | Talk 13:56, 14 February 2007 (CST) fortunately not, else we all would have been ready to be straightjacketed. We were slashdotted earlier today, hence this bizarre number of new accounts. cheers, Robert Tito | Talk 14:06, 14 February 2007 (CST)

approved or draft


draft ≠ approved you can go on when approved draft ---> defininite and that version becomes the talk page (being the draft for version 2. but version 1/draft can be changed until draft = gome. Rob (at least I think so, unless others use some less obvious patterns of thought)

Rob - What is gome? Is that approved? Matt


done. need another pix David Tribe 23:05, 14 February 2007 (CST)

Don't bother!

Hi Matt,

Don't bother undoing the spambot's damage--Jason is fixing it on the database right now.

--Larry Sanger 06:39, 15 February 2007 (CST)

Roger that. Jason is my new hero;) Matt Innis (Talk) 06:43, 15 February 2007 (CST)

Input needed on how to educate more people on category importance,539.0.html -Tom Kelly (Talk) 19:42, 15 February 2007 (CST)

Need help doing this

copied from TK's user talk page-

Hey Tom, I see you need help, whatcha doin and where can I step in? Matt Innis (Talk) 21:12, 15 February 2007 (CST)
Find the list of editors on the citizendium box on the left side. I guess you could start with your own contributions since you are an editor. Go through all your contributions and make sure that the category tags are correct. There should be a CZ Live tag and a Workgroup Tag. -Tom Kelly (Talk) 21:14, 15 February 2007 (CST)
Okay, I'll start at the bottom of the editors list and work my way up. Matt Innis (Talk) 21:19, 15 February 2007 (CST)
Cool, I have an exam coming up and need to focus on school but I really want to see this recent change by workgroup stuff work because it would be so useful. Also, besides just doing it all, we need to educate others on how to do it and why it is important. -Tom Kelly (Talk) 21:34, 15 February 2007 (CST)
Eventually we will need to create a Why this is important page and then whenever you find someone who doesn't do it, leave a quick (automated?) note on their user talk page with a link to the how-to and why it is important article. -Tom Kelly (Talk) 21:38, 15 February 2007 (CST)
Any plan is better than no plan;) Matt Innis (Talk) 21:39, 15 February 2007 (CST)

Spinal adjustment talk

Hi Matt, I see the above talk page has vaporised. I don't want to start anything there, since that might confuse any restoring that has to be done. Any suggestion for interim talk? --Christo Muller (Talk) 06:16, 17 February 2007 (CST)

I am done with "E" now

I had to go drive somewhere half way in between the task. Stephen Ewen 23:12, 17 February 2007 (CST)

AH, that's what happened! I figured I would never catch up so I could start before you findihed and the next thing I know there's more!!! I'm right behind you again:)Matt Innis (Talk) 23:15, 17 February 2007 (CST)

RNA interference

When an article is approved, it should be fully protected, as described on Citizendium_Pilot:Approval_Process#Sysops_make_it_official_with_the_.7B.7BApproved.7D.7D_template, to ensure that further editing occurs on the draft page. David Ellis 21:30, 18 February 2007 (CST)

Yes, the page isn't fully protected; I'm not a constable, and I still see an "edit" tab on the article, not a "view source" tab. To fully protect the page, you can select the "protect" tab on the article, and enter the options edit=sysop and move=sysop into the resulting dialog box. David Ellis 21:59, 18 February 2007 (CST)
There is actually one other issue I'd like to ask for help with, if possible. The text of MediaWiki:Loginprompt, which is displayed above the login dialog box, currently states that "Account creation is temporarily disabled..." I was wondering if you could put a positive spin on the text, so that instead of focusing on how users can't self-register accounts, it invites them to apply for accounts as described on I can't edit MediaWiki:Loginprompt myself, as the editing of all MediaWiki namespace pages is restricted to constables. Thanks. David Ellis 22:24, 18 February 2007 (CST)

Careful with the Js

Hi Matt, be careful with the Js, I've come across two that probably should not have been deleted. --Larry Sanger 23:41, 18 February 2007 (CST)

Careful with the U's?

Is it possible you were over zealous in deleting the article on the United States Constitution? i just noticed this post on the forums. Chris Day (Talk) 10:59, 19 February 2007 (CST)

If there's a problem with the article, I'll be happy to edit it. steve802 11:08, 19 February 2007 (CST)

It was deleted according to the The Big Speedy Delte criteria as being over two weeks since imported from WP without major changes. No problem restoring, though. I also took off the speedy delete tag, but keep an eye on it to make sure it doesn't fall into the list again. If you were to make a recent edit, it would not get deleted. Let me know if it doesn't work! Matt Innis (Talk) 11:27, 19 February 2007 (CST)

Thanks for the restore. I'll take a look at the Speedydelete page - I just saw the email about it this morning. It should be noted that this page was all original work - I did not copy it from Wikipedia. A quick review of the WP article and the one I created would show that, so I'm not sure why the editor who marked it for speedydelete said it was a WP page with three minor edits... I'm not exactly sure how it got marked as edited on Jan 2 by me - I was not even a member at that point, so I think the dates got screwed up somehow. My last edit to the page was on Friday, February 16. Anyway ... thanks again for the restore. steve802 12:12, 19 February 2007 (CST)

I think when some of the vandalism was retored the dates got mixed up. i saw that Jan 2nd date on another article so it may be a systematic error common to a few unrelated articles. Chris Day (Talk) 12:14, 19 February 2007 (CST)
Ohhh, no wonder you were upset! Let me know if that happens again. I'm going to bring this to the constables attention just to make sure. Matt Innis (Talk) 12:18, 19 February 2007 (CST)
There is a means involving delete and selective file restoration that I have used to remove graffiti from the history logs that can cause some date changes if used when genuine edits have taken place after vandal moves. I have used the procedure once elsewhere with date scrambling (on Horse colors if I recall) but verified first that only one user ever edited the page so there are no attribution issue. I was not involved here. Zach Prakowsky (spelling?!) (sorry Zach) understands this issue of file integrity well David Tribe 15:05, 19 February 2007 (CST)
Understood. Thanks for the clarification. I figured you guys knew what you were doing. Matt Innis (Talk) 15:07, 19 February 2007 (CST)


I apologize for the few prior I tagged as BSD you had to kick back. Hopefully that was not at all an issue this time. Stephen Ewen 00:42, 20 February 2007 (CST)

Thanks for the welcome

Glad to be back! Nancy


Hi Matt, Po-Pr is done. :) -Versuri 17:18, 21 February 2007 (CST)

By your comand

™©®BattleStar Galactica

whats that?

DOH, whew from what planet are you? StarTrek, BattleStar Gallactica must ring one bell, or don't you GROK it?
Robert Tito | Talk 22:18, 21 February 2007 (CST)
I'm still trying to figure out why you edits don't show up on anything I look at!!!!! -Matt Innis (Talk) 22:24, 21 February 2007 (CST)

Looks like a BSD straggler

Discourse analysis. Found it by using "Random page". Stephen Ewen 02:22, 22 February 2007 (CST)

Good catch! Matt Innis (Talk) 07:57, 22 February 2007 (CST)

Finishing the archive

Hey matt, could you stick the following template: {{Archive box|auto=long}} at the top of the Talk:Biology/Archive_1.

With this in place it will be possible to toggle between the archives. i think this will be useful when there are more than a couple. It also allows for a quick return to the live talk page. Chris Day (Talk) 17:02, 22 February 2007 (CST)

Now that is NICE! Matt Innis (Talk) 17:38, 22 February 2007 (CST)

Hi Matt, lets try another one. Can you move the whole of Talk:RNA_interference to RNA_interference/Archive 1. Then redirect Talk:RNA_interference to Talk:RNA_interference/Draft using the wikicode #redirect [[Talk:RNA_interference/Draft]]. If this works well we should do this for all the approved articles. Thanks Chris Day (Talk) 03:55, 23 February 2007 (CST)

With all my messing around i have upgraded the original template. The Talk:Biology/Archive_1 now needs the following template, {{Archive box|auto=long|approved=yes}}, to replace the previous one. Thanks Chris Day (Talk) 05:39, 23 February 2007 (CST)

Okay, I'll start with the RNA. Matt Innis (Talk) 07:26, 23 February 2007 (CST)

Looks like it worked great! Now for the new template on Biology. Matt Innis (Talk) 07:31, 23 February 2007 (CST)
Done. See what you think! Matt Innis (Talk) 07:33, 23 February 2007 (CST)


Apologies for using foul language i won't do it again ;) Chris Day (Talk) 22:56, 22 February 2007 (CST)

(((((-: hehehe -Matt Innis (Talk) 23:19, 22 February 2007 (CST)


yes, why not. Seems to me we spent so much unproductive time quibbling about the wording of leads, and I lost track of how often I pleaded to forget the lead until the article was written.....Gareth Leng 12:11, 26 February 2007 (CST)

Image deletions

Yes and yes. I notified Larry Sanger of the images and their problems. He replied with a request that I tag the images for speedydelete and I sent a note to constables AT citizendium DOT org to which I attached LS's note and my earlier note. The legal department at National Geographic has been contacted as well. These images need to come down ASAP. James F. Perry 12:30, 28 February 2007 (CST)

they are down now. Robert Tito | Talk

Didnt realize you had froggy parents

Been workin' hard. Start of semester. Three Four websites to send to college. ;0) David Tribe 15:21, 28 February 2007 (CST)

They were small but really really fast;) I didn't know websites went to college? I sent my kids instead, what was I thinking. ;)Matt Innis (Talk) 15:26, 28 February 2007 (CST)

image too small

Hey Matt i reverted an image back to its original full size but now the approved version needs resizing see Chiropractic#Chiropractic_approach_to_healthcare. I have made the adjustment in the draft version. Chris Day (Talk) 12:36, 5 March 2007 (CST)


for executing the approval and your contribs

archive scientific method

Can you move the current archive at Talk:Scientific method archive 060307 to Talk:Scientific_method/Archive 1. The archive box will only work automatically if the format is correct. I have already added the appropriate archive box. Chris Day (Talk) 11:18, 6 March 2007 (CST)

this is crazy

NO BIO then do not move please

this is the cache bug

Hi Matt, the AMA didn't change their Policy Principles until 1980, but I think (maybe I'm wrong??) that they had already declared that chiropractic had improved sufficient for its members to work with chiropractors before the court case (i.e. that the Policy didn't actually stop members working with chiropractors); the judge said that she didn't believe that they were sincere in this and so found against them. That I think was my reading, but please correct me. There's no doubt that I found the judge's opinion quite stark, and it really made me understand the bitterness from the profession.Gareth Leng 10:11, 8 March 2007 (CST)

you didnt get it

ever seen Po-210? is solid but has more energy than many thought. at least it is ki ll in g, not much for chilling. Robert Tito | Talk

No, that is new to me:) I had a feeling you stated it that way for a reason, I just couldn't think of why? So is a gas still considered low energy? -Matt Innis (Talk) 22:56, 10 March 2007 (CST)

Hidden edits

Yes, Matt. I'm sorry that I kept writing the same stuff about vaccination over and over- I would save it, and not see it and then save it again- so it's ended up being repeated. If I go to edit the page, then I can see comments I have written and others (Gareth? only see the tildes) have written. But if I just hit the discussion tab-none of that shows. Nancy Sculerati MD 14:07, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

==Images== Matt this is your thing I syll don't know how to upload, but take a look here; surely these will be open access??? [1]Gareth Leng 08:15, 14 March 2007 (CDT)

I think we're missing an illustration on Chiropractic, and if we can put it next to the Contents that might work? It'll take the article over size but I don't mind for this. The two pencil drawings are also nice, and deserve to go somewhere; the C is very evocative. There's a bunch of stub chiro articles now though, so there should be plenty of options.

An alternative (or also, why not) might be to put the painting on the Healing Arts page. Are you sure about the license? I dont know about that stuff at all. We'll need to reword the legend a bit.Gareth Leng 08:46, 14 March 2007 (CDT)

Hi Matt, do you have figures for approximate sizes if the ICA ACA WCA etc>? if so we could add them, just to give some indication of relative strengthsGareth Leng 13:01, 15 March 2007 (CDT)

I'll see what I can find. I think I saw them somewhere. --Matt Innis (Talk) 13:19, 15 March 2007 (CDT)


Hi, Matt. After looking at your new picture I just can't see how you let Gareth call you ;-) either fat or white, let alone man. And I now see the natural sympathies that lay between you and Rob! Anyway, can you comment on Critical Views of Chiropractic? It's just that, so I expect it will be unsweet for you- but is it neutral? Is it a fair article for Critcal Views? Nancy Sculerati MD 05:18, 19 March 2007 (CDT)

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Made changes Chiropractic/draft -please check so we can approve

I made some significant changes throughout the Chiropractic article, I explained why on the talk page-mostly I wanted to have "stand-alone" neutrality, and I wanted to be accurate about the whole Flexner thing, which I believe is very relevant, but not to Chiropractic education (only indirectly and years later) but to why the AMA was so hostile to chiropractic professionals, especially the organization, probably over and above working physicians (though I haven't made that point.) Please check it. I think also-as I said somewhere (Talk page again?) additional pictures would be nice-maybe a patent medicine bottle? If the Canada thing is too strong under safety-please remove it. We can put it under critical views. But I removed that comment you made with "diatribe" in it. And yes, Matt I got really cranky when you thought I was the "other guy". I want you to know that I have always been as critical of my own profession as of Chiropractic, and would bark and growl at any medical student or resident who gave ancedotal evidence that wasn't thoughtfully constructed with a biologically perfect rationale, or suggested that we do things a certain way because that's "how Dr. So and So does it". So, having fought my own over what I considered foolishness, I am not prepared to let it go for chiropractic. And I treated oodles of patients for free, and never understood the whole small business concept as valid when it came to sick kids. (In other words-I took the chickens) So there you are- I am, in a sense, "your worst nightmare" as an MD collaborator for some of these issues. And I don't mean you as you, Matt, but you as the present representative of the entire history and practice of Chiropractic. (Believe me, neither of us deserve that title for either profession, but we have at least the shadow of it by default here).Thanks, Nancy Nancy Sculerati MD 06:53, 23 March 2007 (CDT)

I try not to get too attached to anything I write because I know that by the time we are all finished, the end result is better than anything I could have written by myself. I think you have a beautiful style and am quite sure that you follow your heart. I understand the hours and frustration you have invested here, but I know that, when I did my research, I learned so much, I forgot what I "knew" before. I hope it has helped you understand that there are more than one side to every story and the most thrilling moments are when you find a new piece to the puzzle. That is what you gave me last night. I hope I can do the same for you someday. --Matt Innis (Talk) 10:35, 23 March 2007 (CDT)

You already have. Nancy Sculerati MD 11:12, 23 March 2007 (CDT)

Image good. :-| David Tribe 21:16, 24 March 2007 (CDT)