CZ Talk:Editorial Council Suggestion Box

Before starting to vote about editcouncil matters it seems wise to ask all members of CZ for suggestions. Allowing the members of the editcouncil to get feed back and knowledge about the "world" support for motions. Last vote was 24-0 indicating 24 decide for all of the community - where authors cannot vote. Lets give them influence at least. --Robert Tito

"Last vote was 24-0 indicating 24 decide for all of the community - where authors cannot vote."

• Unless I am misinterpreting what this represents, that is oligarchy, and a horrible direction for an online representative democracy. Authors should have representatives within the voting body that drives the project. This will kill this project unless remedied, and "We Ain't Elitist" needs a formal retraction. Stephen Ewen 14:19, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

I always thought this is what we would do--either that, or have a separate body. Certainly, let's draw up a resolution about how to get author representation in the Council. --Larry Sanger 14:26, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

As to Rob's first sentence, "Before starting to vote about editcouncil matters it seems wise to ask all members of CZ for suggestions," that is precisely what the guidelines on Editorial Council How to Make a Resolution say. --Larry Sanger 14:31, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

Is optional listening enough? I think if you'd ask authors, who are likely to make up 90% of all contributors, they'd disagree. What is very worrisome is that the EC has such broad powers: "including, but not limited to". Already, among these suggestions, there are some issues I'd argue that the council has no business whatsoever deciding alone for the entirety of the project--licensing--and for specific workgroups--Biology scientific names question. The EC must not be The Project Governing Council, but must have a much stricter purvey. Otherwise, I think some serious 50/50 representation is needed. Yep, democracy can be messy. Stephen Ewen 17:44, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

E.g., a sort of House of Commons to go along with a sort of House of Lords, is one way. Stephen Ewen 01:56, 30 May 2007 (CDT)

"under construction" or "scholarly work in progress"

I added this to the suggestion box as both a way to 1)let the general public know that the article is not finished and in fact may be in total disarray at times as we are still working through it and 2)to motivate editors to get their articles approved. Articles such as Intelligent design and Global warming are the reason I thought them necessary initially. I am totally open to feedback however. --Matt Innis (Talk) 14:38, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

This seems like an excellent suggestion to me. There are several reasons beginning with "silence implies consent". If an article isn't explicitly marked as anything other than a completed article, then the public is likely to consider it as final. Another reason is that the whole point (at least according to my understanding) of Citizendium is to be reliable. In the case of articles that are not yet approved, we have not yet done our job. Finally, I agree that it is important to have an incentive for moving articles through the approval process. Several people I've spoken to take the opposite point of view, arguing (not unreasonably) that it would be unwise to approve articles prematurely. But at this point, I think the greater danger is that articlew will remain undeveloped, or that debates will go on and on, while the articles themselve remain in limbo. To the extent that we fail to develop articles to the point where they may be approved and approve them, we are failing. Greg Woodhouse 16:02, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

We used to have such a notice. The trouble was that it was put on all articles, and there was no technically easy way to remove it for approved articles. As a stopgap measure, we have "All unapproved articles are subject to a disclaimer; please read." That's at the top of every page, just beneath "The world needs a better free encyclopedia..."

Theoretically, we could place a template by hand on every single unapproved article (!). --Larry Sanger 16:09, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

Why not a single template that picks up the status of the article? After all, won't an article be approved if and only if its status is 0? Greg Woodhouse 16:16, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

Hmmm. I sure don't want to hand tag again;-) I know this can get dangerously close to wikipedia's template crazy environment, so we have to be sure we don't go there. But something along that line would motivate editors to approve as well as warn readers that we have not *yet* endorsed this article, so even student's won't use it as a reference. --Matt Innis (Talk) 17:03, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

Well, if Jason and Greg aren't up to it, and someone wants to make a bot........ --Larry Sanger 17:23, 29 May 2007 (CDT)

Recognizing authors

Develop a system for recognizing authors for their experience and expertise. One very simple way absent something more complex is to develop a method for awarding an Author Award of Excellence. Three editors agree and they get it, or something like that. It'd have to be a template placed on the userpage, however. ---Stephen Ewen 04:11, 30 May 2007 (CDT)

Require Edit Summary for all edits?

Absolutely not. Require it on all major ones, perhaps. But there is just no way that I am going to make an edit summary every time I catch something I could phrase slightly better on a page I am authoring, particularly if doing so alone at the moment. I don't typically make edit summaries in that instance and don't want to be bothered with doing so. On the other hand, I give a detailed edit summary every time it really matters, and when other contributors have clearly been working before me. Stephen Ewen 01:39, 2 June 2007 (CDT)