User talk:Andrew Su

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Welcome, new editor! We're very glad you've joined us. Here are pointers for a quick start. Also, when you get a chance, please read The Editor Role. You can look at Getting Started and our help system for other introductory pages. It is also important, for project-wide matters, to join the Citizendium-L (broadcast) mailing list. Announcements are also available via Twitter. You can test out editing in the sandbox if you'd like. If you need help to get going, the forum is one option. That's also where we discuss policy and proposals. You can ask any administrator for help, too. Just put a note on their "talk" page. Again, welcome and thank you! We appreciate your willingness to share your expertise, and we hope to see your edits on Recent changes soon. --Larry Sanger 20:41, 3 April 2007 (CDT)

hide function

hi Andrew, one thing you'll note is that the hide/show function does not work here. I'm not sure what the problem is and have not looked into it too hard. If you figure out the problem that would be great. Clearly the protein template functions better with that option available. Glad to see you porting the stuff over here too. Was the test run a success in wikipedia? I noticed your intern beavering away. Chris Day (talk) 13:34, 21 August 2007 (CDT)

After mentioning this, I'm not even sure if you are utilising the hide/show functionality in the protein2 emplate. I had noticed your intern experimenting with the idea and assumed your were going to include it. Sorry for any confusion. Chris Day (talk) 13:38, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
I'll take a look at this in a bit. Maybe he made that change in a sandbox template. You don't happen to remember the link that says that PDB/RSCB images are in the public domain, do you? Andrew Su 13:46, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
Possibly a sandbox, he had used it to hide the gene ontologies. Not a bad idea since that can be a very long list for some proteins. As far as the link is concerned, I have no idea. Try User:TimVickers at wikipedia. Chris Day (talk) 13:51, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
Looks like I did copy over the right template, just not something that is implemented here. In Template:Protein2 the relevant syntax is right above the ECnumber actually. Anyway, I don't know enough of wikicode or javascript to take this much further. Hopefully, one of the pros can have a look... Andrew Su 14:01, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
Well don't look at me. I'm sure it will get sorted out eventually and the code does not interfere with the funtion of the template. So best just to leave it in for now while we wait for it to become active. Chris Day (talk) 14:03, 21 August 2007 (CDT)

One more thing. If your plan is to add the protein2 template to the external links subpage(or a gene function subpage) we could probably revamp it since suddenly the whole page is available rather than cramping it off to the right. Chris Day (talk) 14:03, 21 August 2007 (CDT)

Yeah, another one of those things where I played with it for a couple of minutes to convince myself I'd make things worse before I made them better. CSS wizardry (well, all of CSS is wizardry to me...) If others who have more experience come by to make the change, then great. If not, I'll dig into it later. Right now, still trying to gauge whether there's enough support/enthusiasm here at CZ to take this on in parallel to the WP effort, and/or whether it makes sense for me/us based on what's possible with CZ licensing... Andrew Su 14:08, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
As far as i can tell CZ licensing is up in the air, still. I'm enthusiastic to get this going, either wikipedia or CZ. i'd prefer CZ due to the editorial oversight, that I feel would be a good carrot to attract the best academics. It might be harder to to convince them that wikipedia is the way to go. Here, the articles can be protected against random vandalism and that must be a selling point for the academic community. Chris Day (talk) 14:45, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
Yeah, I hear you and understand the arguments. The flip side is that WP has the edge on user/contributors, but of course we all hope CZ gets there. I'm agnostic right now (or rather, unsure of the better route) so I'm tempted to do both. Of course, this is assuming we can get the license issue worked out, but I'm hopeful. Andrew Su 14:53, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
Both is good too. We should not see this as competing projects, rather different projects. In wikipedia, while there are many, there may not be many interested in protein stubs. However, I'd be interested to see which ones do get adopted by members of that community. We may find that different subsets get worked on by the two different communities. It would also be an excellent experiment to see how the academic community responds given the option of both WP and CZ. Chris Day (talk) 14:57, 21 August 2007 (CDT)


I just added a function page to the approved list for you. Have fun. Chris Day (talk) 18:12, 21 August 2007 (CDT)

Fine-lined version

I'm not sure why PDB uses the term "public domain" to release their material--they seem to have created their own fine-lined version of it, see here. According to the PDB, the tag here is simply not factual. I thus made a special tag and re-tagged the images here so potential re-users can be fully informed about it.  —Stephen Ewen (Talk) 00:54, 12 September 2007 (CDT)

Thanks for the clarification. perhaps this is something we need to clear up with the PDB folks... Andrew Su 11:25, 12 September 2007 (CDT)
Alright, it's simple, really. They simply are not PD materials and recently created works cannot be PD but automatically are copyrighted. The creator can, however, give others rights to use the works. This is what the PDB has done in a self-styled way rather than use a CC license, or the like. In short, the works are copyrighted and cannot not be in the case of a non-governmental federal agency author. PDB just allow considerable free use, and , and call it "public domain". WP and the Commons does the same thing, and, they have "created" PD-self, which really does not exist. But actually, they understand some of this correctly[1], although the term someone threw in there "irrevocable", is pure high-falootin' hooey. The CC folks recognize this stuff and have created their Public Domain Dedication, which even they appear to have doubts over.  —Stephen Ewen (Talk) 18:36, 1 October 2007 (CDT)
Another way to think of it is like this.  —Stephen Ewen (Talk) 01:01, 2 October 2007 (CDT)
Super, thanks for the updated information and links. I'll admit, this is one of those issues I'd just rather not think about... ;) Andrew Su 11:28, 2 October 2007 (CDT)

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